By Sunny Anderson Osiebe...
Hon. Edward G. Pwajok, an accomplished lawyer and former Attorney General of Plateau State is
arguably one of the most active and vibrant member of the Federal House of
Representatives. Although he is a first termer, he has been able to distinguish
himself from the crowd of legislators as lawmaker worthy of the mandate given
him by those he represents. Hon. Pwajok, current Chairman, House Committee on
Human Rights, is a man who knows his onions as far as the business of lawmaking
is concerned. In this interview with Anderson Osiebe, Hon. Pwajok shares his
thoughts and concerns on certain key issues that affect the House of
Representatives and the Nigerian nation among others.
Describe your journey so far in
the 1st Session of the 8th National Assembly?
Well, it has been a challenging legislative year for us in the
legislature. Being my first term here, it was like a trying period but I did my
best to participate actively in the activities of the House of Representative,
especially in the area of preparing Bills and Motions. During the period under
review, I was able to move six (6) motions which passed the floor of the House.
I presented twenty-nine (29) Bills, which are in various stages, though one (1)
has passed third reading and has been sent to the senate. I was a member
of at least three (3) adhoc committees set up by the House of Representatives
to tackle certain sensitive national issues. I am a member of six (6)
committees, in addition to chairing the House Committee on Human Rights and I participated
actively in all these committees, particularly, in the oversight functions.
So, to God be the glory, it was a very
enriching and active year for me.
The past one year was promulgated to have been dedicated
to leadership tussle, especially in the Senate, thereby affecting
the business of the day. What is your take on this promulgation?
To begin with, I am not a member of the
Senate but a member of the House of Representatives. So, it is unfitting for me
to hold brief for the Senate as I may not be conversant with the actual goings-on
of the Upper House. Suffice it to say that for the House of Representatives, you
will certainly commend us as we have been able to present hundreds of bills.
About six hundred and eighty-five (685) bills were presented on the floor of
the House within one year. Out of which I think about ten came from the Executive.
Although, other bills are private members bills.
Prior to my coming here, I served as
the Attorney General of Plateau state and consequent to that position, I had
always nursed the notion that the Executive present more Bills than private
members since that was the case in Plateau state, where I served but on coming
here, I was shocked to see that the reverse is the case with the 8th National
Assembly. Here you have private members sponsoring more bills than the
government itself. To this extent you can say that the lower house is doing
very well; not only in terms of the number of Bills that have been sponsored
but in the quality of the bills as they (Bills) will certainly affect the
nation in one way or the other - positively. Most of the Motions too, have been
very progressive. We have hundreds of them bordering on the lives of the members
of our constituencies and also the nation; public interest issues that affect
economy - employment, security, gender issues and so on.
So, without mincing words, I can say
that I am proud to belong to this 8th National Assembly.
As an
astute lawmaker, what areas do you think that the House of Representatives
needs to improve on?
Certainly, there are areas that need improvement.
One of such areas as some of us have identified borders on the voting process
of the House. There has to be a transparent voting process to aid accuracy. To
this extent, the process for electronic voting has been initiated and I must
commend the Speaker for rising to the occasion. We have been given forms to
fill and afterwards, we will be issued our electronic cards. Hopefully, very
soon, we will start voting electronically because the current process where
members vote by orally - either by saying Ayes or nays and the nays have it or
the ayes have it, is controversial. Sometimes, the Speaker may decide in
accordance with his capricesor his discretion to determine whether the ayes
have it or the nays have it.In a civilised country such as ours, our constituents
ought to follow us in terms of where we stand on any issue before the National Assembly.
Therefore, it is essential to carry them along. They need to know what member A
or member B votes on any given issue. Constituents need to know whether you are
representing their interest or not. In fact, in other countries, when it comes
to election or re-election, the representative is judged based on how he/she votes
on the floor of the House.
Thus, I must commend the leadership of
the National Assembly, particularly, the House of Representatives for rising to
the occasion because it is a progressive step that will enable us be very
proactive and alive to our responsibilities. It will also encourage us to be sensitive
when voting, bearing in mind the weight of the decisions we are about to make
as it goes beyond just pressing the button. Your constituency and the country
is going to be affected in one way or the other by how you vote and you have
just three buttons – Yes, No or you abstain – three options! So, it is a welcomed
development.
Another area where I would like to see
improvement will be the style of debate. Some of us come from backgrounds, where
we are accustomed to robust debates. I have observed that sometimes many bills
are not actually debated at the second reading level. Though this may be due to
the countless number of Bills before the House of Representatives.
Nevertheless, I will appreciate it if more time is allocated to robust debate
of issues because a law is not just a trivial thing as it affects not just the
member sponsoring the bill or the National Assembly as an institution but the
entire country. For instance, I may sponsor a Bill in the bid of positively
affecting my constituency but when the Bill is passed into law, it affects the
whole of Nigeria. Hence, the need for other members to make input on that Bill.
Even if other members, while debating the Bill on the floor of the House, decide
that the Bill should not see the light of the day, then so be it. I should
simply bow to the superior wisdom of others. We are in democracy; the minority
should have their say and the majority should have theirs, as well but where as
it happened in the House, last year, many Bills were not robustly debated after
their lead debate by the presenters or the sponsors of the bill, then the
question is espoused and invariably you may have the ‘nays’ having it or the ‘ayes’
having it. This is not supposed to be because the nation itself, even we,
ourselves may not be conversant with the issues contained in those Bills and
some of these bills have far reach implications for the entire country. So, the
five(5) or ten (10) minutes allocated to a member to speak on a Bill, is not
sufficient to cover an entire field. But when you have others contributing,
some will go the extra mile to do further research and may come up with
relevant information or other perspectives that the sponsor of the Bill is unaware
of and that may add value to the Bill. So, I think it is crucial we improve on
this area.
Well, I may not say much in terms of
oversight functions. However, I think we did not do much of oversight because
of some teething problems of the 8th Assembly but now that the budget itself
has been assented to by the President, we hope that monies will be allocated to
various committees to do their oversight functions and that will ensure
transparency in governance by the Ministries, Departments and Agencies. It will
also ensure accountability and add value to governance. These are some of the
few areas I can identify.
Seeing
that the economy is nose-diving, what do you think the legislature should do to
salvage the situation?
Everyone has a role to play in saving
the day. If you analyse some of the Bills being considered in the National
Assembly, particularly, in the House of Representatives, you will see that some
of them, if passed and assented to by the President, will raise the revenue
profile of the government. An example, will be the bill to add Valerian tax on
the National Communications Commission, hence, consumers’ tax will be paid in
accordance with their usage of mobile phones. This will generate more revenue
to the government because if you look at the trillions of naira being made
by service providers such as MTN, GLOBACOM and other mobile network service
providers, how much does government make? In a modern day, government should
make more money from tax than from oil. Our fortunes from oil are dwindling.
Thus, the National Assembly can intervene by ensuring that there is progressive
taxation. Not to the extent, that it will bite the common man, more but to have
the multinational companies; the big companies making big profits; banks, pay
more to the coffers of government. So, government would be able to discharge
its obligations to the citizenry. We can also generate laws that will block
leakages in terms of public funds being wasted.
There are other ways too that influence
our cohesion as a country; that will foster national unity and gender issues.
For instance, there are issues that border on our women, who are about the half
of the population of the country and as of now, I will say that they are
marginalized. A country that, truly, wants to progress must carry along her
women folks. Not only because they are women but because they are fully half of
the population. A country with over 170 million, having half of her population either
in kitchens or in bedrooms; not properly engaging them, is only cheating
herself. If we adequately engage them, then there will be more productivity, adding
more value to the economy. Our economy will leap forth. When you do a research
on why China and India are where they are today in the world, in terms of development,
you will see it is for this same reason. They engage their women folks in
economic activities. So, Nigeria has to tag along in the same way. We have to
find a way of deemphasizing some of our old traditions and cultural norms. So
that our women can have a say in the affairs of the country and our youth too.
We have to ensure that our youths are gainfully employed. We must find a way to
absorb the fresh graduates in either in the public sector or the private
sector. They have to be engaged again because they are in the majority of the
population and are very productive. That is the time that they are fresh, energetic;
have ideas and strength. So, if they are not incorporated in the affairs of the
state, then we will only be short-changing ourselves as a nation and not
engaging them will mean flaming the thrive of insecurity in the country as
these are people that are well trained and some of them are not doing anything.
Thus, the saying an idle man is the devil's workshop.
These are all the areas that progressive
legislation can address because in addressing them, we will be tackling most
problems of the country, especially problem of insecurity, corruption,
unemployment and need for economic advancement.
Let’s look at the issue of corruption. What areas
do you think the legislators can step in to help the Executive fight the menace?
The Constitution in section 88 and 89,
has given us the power to investigate all the public institutions who utilize
public funds as appropriated to them by law. So, having an Appropriation Act,
which is the budget, we are empowered to investigate such agencies, where we
suspect that there is wastage of public funds or any other form of corruption
because these funds are, first, provided for by the Appropriation Act. That is
the National Assembly has already made provisions; provided funds for those Agencies.This
is implicit in section 88 of the Constitution. Hence, while in our oversight functions,
we ought to be seen carrying out these investigations to ensure that corruption
is eliminated in the affairs of government.
Despite being a first termer, you have pushed
several bills and motions in the last one year. What impacts have these Bills
and Motions on good governance?
Well, most of the Bills have not been
assented to and until a Bill goes through the complete cycle of law-making –
pass through the House of Representatives, the Senate and then Mr President
assents to it - you cannot call it a law and if you cannot call it a law then
you cannot see its impact because it has not formed part of the laws of the Federation
of Nigeria. Well, for the Motions, I have raised motions on the operations of
banks with regards to some of the charges being made on Nigerians and also the
central bank’s cashless policy. The last time I read, the CBN said they have
made commercial banks to refund about N26billion to customers.That is
progressive and it is flowing directly from my motion. However, I still need to
investigate the veracity of the report. It is one thing for the Central bank to
make that pronouncement and it is another thing for the customers to, actually acknowledge
that they are in receipt of such refunds. For what it is worth, I feel
satisfied that at least we are addressing some of the issues, touching on the
welfare of Nigerians.
I also raised, by motion, the issue of lack
of quorum in INEC. The need for the President to make more appointments in that
commission because of the important functions the body performs in the country.
During the period under review, the President forwarded the name of some
individuals, who were then appointed National Commissioners. Otherwise, we may
not have had elections in Kogi state and some other states of the country. So,
I thank God that, again, a motion I brought to the floor of the House, saw the light
of day, though there is still need for improvement because the appointments
made by the President did not fully address the issues I raised in my motion as
there should be full composition of INEC as a body. As of now, we do not
have the full complement of the Resident Electoral Commissioners and the
National Commissioners in INEC. Thus, I encourage the President to nominate
more National Commissioners and Resident Electoral Commissioners.So we have the
Commission duly and fully composed to discharge its duties.
What areas do you hope to strengthen?
This year, In addition to working again
on Bills and Motions that will add value to the nation, I intend to commit,
deeply, to the Committee work as there were issues with the budget, last year. Though,
the budget came in late this year, I still have to participate, actively, to
ensure that a lot of work is done at the Committee stage. There’re things done
at that level that people may not know about. You interact with the
Executive; at least the Ministries, the departments and agencies of the
executive arm of government, in determining the implementation of the budget
for the year. That way you will be able to influence project execution in one way
or the other. So, this year, I hope to make myself useful in this regard.
Recently the assumed peace enjoyed by the Niger deltans
was suddenly interrupted by activities of the Niger delta avengers. How can the
House of Representatives come in to arrest this ugly trend?
Not only in the House of
Representatives but I know that as a House, we have raised some motions that
will make the thoughts of the House of Representativeson any issue, known, to
the public and to the Executive. So, you can be sure that the House of
Representatives is not comfortable with the resurgence of the vandalism in the
oil industries, particularly, in the Niger delta. I will implore the Federal Government
to collaborate with members of the National Assembly, particularly those from
the Niger delta. Being their constituencies, they know the history of the
struggle better than the rest of us who are not from there. Since the people
vandalising the pipelines are from their constituencies, thus, they will have
better ideas or suggestions as to how to go about tackling the issue.
My advice is that we should give more
primacy to diplomacy than using raw military force. Using the military has its
own limitations but when you adopt the diplomatic approach, it pays off. The
approach, though, time-consuming and nerve-straining, since you may be talking
to people who require lots of patience to deal with- will gain more because on
the long run you will assuage fraying nerves. You will succeed in letting
the people see things from government's perspective and also make them
understand what government wants. I mean, if there is peace in the Niger delta,
we will be able to exploit our oil resources without hassles. Currently we are
exploiting oil way below our capacity. Before this uprising, we boast of
exploiting 2.2 million barrels per day, but now I am told we exploit about 1.2
to 1.4/6 million barrels per day. This is one of the reasons the economy is
plummeting. So I encourage government to focus on collaborating with my
colleagues from the Niger delta to arrest this ugly situation. I have been chatting
with these honourable members and they are progressive people, who don’t want
to see the crisis going on in their backyard but the progress of the country.
However, they cannot act alone. The Executive has to back them up or cooperate
with them and honestly, if that is done, we will see the end of this crisis.
Most communicators nurse the notion that the legislature
has not done enough in the area of oversight functions. What is your position
on this?
I agree that we have not done much in
terms of oversight, which is why I earlier mentioned it among the areas I hope
to work on, this new legislative session. In the last legislative year, there
were limitations to what the House of Representatives could do in the area of
oversight functions. The prominent one was funding. For instance, I am aware
that most committees when they apply for funds for their oversight functions,
are given an average of N2million naira and such amount may not be enough for
you to do an oversight function. For instance, if you are asked to travel to Borno
state with a 20-man committee, to carry out oversight functions. Given the
security challenges of the northeast and the distance of the place, that amount
of money will not be enough. Also, because we represent the people considering
the fact that we are expected carry them along at every stage while carrying
out oversight functions. Consequent to this, we have to publicise the
activities of the committees both in the electronic and in the print media and ensure
that the press community is carried along and you know that that doesn’t come
easy. So, the funding has been a major challenge.
Some committees who submit a budget of
about N50-60million to carry out an oversight function, if you look at the
details of their budget or proposals, you will see that they can be justified.
They are not just quoting some huge and outlandish amount of money. But when
this money is not provided, they will not be able to do the work. When a Bill has
passed its second reading and is committed to the relevant committee, the
committee is supposed to advertise it in the media, so the citizenry are aware
that this Bill is coming up. There ought to be a public hearing, where other
stakeholders and experts will be invited to participate. This adds value to
law-making and Bill making. But where there is no money, to publicize the
activities of the House or even to invite members of the public to participate,
then, somehow, the value of the works we do and even the laws we churn out is
reduced. My committee is supposed to carry out an investigation on the case of
a Youth Corps member who was killed during the rerun election in Rivers state.
As we speak, no funds have been provided for that oversight function.To
effectively, carrying out this investigation, we have to travel to Rivers state
because when dealing with issues of human rights, there should be transparency and
fair-hearing. You have to hear from both sides. Also, we have to ensure that there
is appropriate security when we undertake such assignment. So, these are some
of the issues we have to take into consideration when looking at the challenges
of the oversight functions.
Honestly, lack of funds is an
impediment in the implementation of the oversight functions of the legislature.
So, I pray that the National Assembly will be able to look at this area in the
bid of addressing the issue because it helps.
On the
issue of bipartisanship, can you recall instances where bipartisanship has come
in handy in resolving national issues?
Well, the recent hike in the price of
petroleum products (PMS), from about N86.50 to N145 was a classic example of bipartisanship
application in the National Assembly. We did not look at the issue from party
lines, rather, we looked at it from a pure nationalistic perspective. You would
agree that for now there are no fuel queues in most parts of the country. Of
course, fuel is selling at a high rate now but at least, it is available and even
before the price of fuel was increased – I don’t want to use the
term removal of subsidy or deregulation because those are misleading
terms as subsidy has not been officially removed neither has there has been any
official deregulation because there is still a ceiling on the price of fuel. It
is the day that you don't have ceiling and market forces are allowed to
determine the prices of these products that you will say, yes, there is
deregulation.
So, the price of fuel had to be
increased to meet the recommendations of Central bank and NNPC on foreign
exchange issues. The increase was done to enable them source for Foreign exchange,
to import refined petroleum products into the country with the promise that
with time, the prices of petroleum products will go down because of the forces
of supply and demand. We pray and hope in the interest of the marginalised
people in this country, that the prices will significantly go down because
after all, the international price of these commodities are not really high, so
why is it that it is when prices are going down in the international
market, they will be going up here in Nigeria. Truly, we have to resolve this
issue. Still on bipartisanship, most issues that are raised on the floor of the
House, we applying the principles of bipartisanship in treating them because we
consider the national interest. Take the Kogi case for example. When the House
of Representatives decided to invoke section 11, subsection 4 of the
constitution, so as to take over the affairs of the Kogi state House of Assembly,
it was not based on any party issue but on national interest. We had to step in
and there was no issue of APC or PDP and it is like that with other issues.
Thus, I would say that on most issues bordering on the interest of the nation,
the House of Representatives in particular, does not tow party lines.
What can
be done to redress the godfatherism malaise?
The summary of it is we are advocating
for power to belong to the people. If the people are allowed to determine who
represents them at whatever level, you will not have the phenomenon of godfatherism
but the question is - does power actually reside with the people? We go through
the rituals of periodic elections every four years or when there are annulment
orders of the court, where you find that the parties themselves are not
democratic. It is a few persons who control the parties. That is why you keep having
the phenomenon of godfatherism in the country. It is a real challenge that we
have as a country and until we overcome it, we will continue to experience the situation
where a few people determine for the populace, who represents them at whatever
level; whether at the executive level or the legislative level. Some of us are
not comfortable with that, which is why we are introducing certain Bills in the
National Assembly, to democratize the parties and further democratize the
country. Provide for any independent candidate because if the Constitution
allows for independent candidacy, you may now have, even, fewer parties in the
system because the people will know that for certain offices, one does not have
to join any party. A commoner can just offer himself and be voted in as a Counsellor,
Member House of Assembly and Member House of Representatives or even as a Governor!
We have people contesting for the office of the President in the United States,
even as independent candidates. Once this is done, it will add value and reduce
the issue of godfatherism because the godfatherism issue is a party
issue, where there are always cliques within parties that ensure that only
candidates of their choice get to contest. Unfortunately, the system is such
that the courts are not supposed to dabble into the domestic affairs of
political parties. To this extent, parties deny their very own ‘ordinary’
members, participation in decision-making. That is not democratic. So, you see
why we still have a long way to go in addressing this issue of godfatherism in
our polity.
Challenges
experienced as a lawmaker in the past one year?
Well, I won’t say they are unique to
me. They are general to all of us that are legislators because of the
environment in which we found ourselves. One, there is the issue of our
developmental stage as a country. If you go to other advanced democracies, the
challenges we are faced with as legislators are not faced by our colleagues
over there. For instance, on a daily basis, each legislator has a barrage of
demands from members of his constituency or even outside his constituency, on
personal needs because there is paucity of resources. People are asking you to
help them pay school fees, medical bills, house rents and all other personal
issues. To be honest, most of my colleagues, myself inclusive, try our best to
address some of these issues; to offer help where we can but because our
resources are also severely limited, we cannot address even 1% of the demands
that come to us. Regrettably, that has become one of the factors by which the
people judge you. You are considered a success or failure based on how much of
these demands, you meet. This is a seething challenge and I wish that there
could be a reorientation of the populace in this regard. Thus, changing the
indices used to judge the performance of our Legislators. If you look at the Constitution,
our primary role as legislators is law-making or even oversights functions. We
neither execute nor give contracts. In fact by the code of conduct law, we are
not even supposed to engage in private business apart from farming. Then, if
you have shares, you derive dividends from them but not to manage or actively
participate in any business. But the public assume that we swim in huge amounts
of money. Hence, where they see you are not meeting their demands, they see you
as a failure.
Honestly, I wish this issue can be
addressed and how it can be addressed is when the welfare needs of Nigerians
are being addressed - the economy is doing better; more people are gainfully
employed and the level of literacy goes up, slashing down the level of
ignorance.People will begin to appreciate the Legislature. They will actually
work with the Legislators. It is not to be paying school fees, medical bills or
doing roads. That is the work of the Executive. But even if you start singing
from morning till evening, people still will not believe you and that is why
many of us still have to share our little income with members of our
constituency. Well, we are not complaining because like I told you they
are the ones that voted us in. Therefore, they are also part of us. I hope we
are able to trash this developmental challenges.
How many bills and motions have you moved in the
last one year?
I sponsored twenty-nine (29) bills and
six (6) motions.
Can you tell us something about the prominent bills
you sponsored?
Well, the Official Secret Act has
passed its third reading and it is prominent. There is another bill on the
Amendment of the Code of Conduct Tribunal Bureau Act - one is for Constitution
Amendment and one is the Act, itself. There is another on the Investment and
Security Act and one on Allocation of Repeal. These are some of the prominent
ones but all of them are very relevant to good governance.
What plan do you have for your constituents in the
area of empowerment?
It is embedded in my Constituency
Outreach Projects because the budget has provisions for zonal intervention by
Legislators. Probably those that have commenced their empowerment exercises are
old termers here. Some of them second termers, third termers and fourth termers
but we that are first termers, this is the first time that our constituency
projects have been approved and it is only now that some of them will be
implemented. So, until they are implemented you cannot really say that you have
something to show in that regard. However, I have some projects. Some have to
do with infrastructural developments like road constructions in the rural area
and the provision of motorized solar powered boreholes. I also have some in the
area of health - to increase medical awareness and do some interventions that
will address some of the health challenges of my constituents. In this new
legislative year, these are the areas, I would like to look at.
What should we expect in the nearest future in
regards to Bills and Motions?
More bills, more motions. More robust debates from
making contributions on the floor of the House and active participation too, at
various committees and all the activities of the National Assembly.
Implementation of my Constituency Know Project and advocacy on behalf of my
constituents for them to benefit from Federal government programs, in terms of
recruitment, employment and all what not. I have to ensure that my people are
fairly represented. This may mean going out of the National assembly to
aggressively tackle some of this issues.
BILLS SPONSORED BY HON. EDWARD
GYANG PWAJOK IN THE 1st SESSION OF THE 8th NATIONAL
ASSEMBLY
BILLS
1.
Educational (national
minimum standards and establishment of institutions ) act (amendment) bill,
2015
2.
Amendment of fiscal
responsibility act, 2007
3.
Federal character
commission (establishment, e,t.c) act (amendment) bill, 2016
4.
Labour act (amendment)
bill, 2016
5.
Public account
implementation tribunal act (repeal) bill, 2016
6.
Public account
committee act (amendment) bill, 2016
7.
Code of conduct and
tribunal act (amendment) bill, 2016
8.
Allocation of revenue
(federation account) bill, 2015
9.
Interpretation
(amendment) bill, 2015
10. A
bill for an act to amend the electoral act, 2010
11. Investment
and securities act, 2004
12. Establish
the promotion of the democracy commission, 2015
13. Constitution
of the federal republic of Nigeria (alteration) bill, 2015 – to establish more
code of conduct tribunals.
14. An
act to amend the casino taxation act, 2016
15. Constitution
of the Federal Republic of Nigeria (National Industrial Court) (Alteration)
bill, 1999
16. Official
Secrets Act, CAP03, LFN (Amendment) bill, 2004
17. Internal
Loans Act, CAP118, LFN (Amendment) bill, 2004
18. Internal
Loans Act, CAP119, LFN (Amendment) bill, 2004
19. Constitution
of the Federal Republic of Nigeria (Alteration) bill, 1999 – as altered in
related matters to allow investigation outside recognised security agencies.
20. A
Bill for an Act to establish the office of the Accountant General of the
Federation, 2016
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